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 Nature or Nurture?

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EvilHippyEmperor
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PostSubject: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 12:22 am

I've just been watching an interesting programme that set out to discover how much of a person's personality is set before birth (this week dealt specifically with homosexuality).

It just started me wondering: How much of your "gothiness" do you think you were born with?

I think the seeds of my gothiness have been in me all my life. I have always loved the darker, more elegant things in life. Certainly my actual appearance has been influenced by things I encounter in life, but many friends with similar experiences have turned out very different.

What about you?

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sinderella
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 12:30 am

EvilHippyEmperor wrote:
I've just been watching an interesting programme that set out to discover how much of a person's personality is set before birth (this week dealt specifically with homosexuality).

It just started me wondering: How much of your "gothiness" do you think you were born with?

I think the seeds of my gothiness have been in me all my life. I have always loved the darker, more elegant things in life. Certainly my actual appearance has been influenced by things I encounter in life, but many friends with similar experiences have turned out very different.

What about you?


My parents were called to the school as I kept colouring everything in black! (I was 5 years old)

I was a bit of a geek (school orchestra, choir, gardening club) at school which tended to set me aside form the others a little.

Plus I convinced my folks to buy me a black school uniform telling them I did not have to have the navy blue Very Happy

Even at about the age of 11/12 I started to dye my hair, wear lots of black eyeliner, and shop in charity shops for clothes.

I do not know if it was my own style or if I was being influenced by the new romantic scene at the time.

...and it has been downhill ever since! lol!
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GWE
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 12:32 am

I think mine came from a very early age, I have very vivid memories from when I was 18 months old of living next door to a funeral directors and for years I was too small too look over the garden wall. I was desperate to look over the wall to see the coffins. Also my Uncle was a carpenter and in his back garden was always old bits of wood and one day I built a make shift coffin and gave the yard broom a buriel scratch , my Nan really told me off!! Neutral

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GWE
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sinderella
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 12:34 am

GWE wrote:
I think mine came from a very early age, I have very vivid memories from when I was 18 months old of living next door to a funeral directors and for years I was too small too look over the garden wall. I was desperate to look over the wall to see the coffins. Also my Uncle was a carpenter and in his back garden was always old bits of wood and one day I built a make shift coffin and gave the yard broom a buriel scratch , my Nan really told me off!! Neutral

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GWE
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...and do you still have a broom fetish my dear? affraid Laughing
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GWE
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 12:41 am

sinderella wrote:
GWE wrote:
I think mine came from a very early age, I have very vivid memories from when I was 18 months old of living next door to a funeral directors and for years I was too small too look over the garden wall. I was desperate to look over the wall to see the coffins. Also my Uncle was a carpenter and in his back garden was always old bits of wood and one day I built a make shift coffin and gave the yard broom a buriel scratch , my Nan really told me off!! Neutral

Love
GWE
XXX


...and do you still have a broom fetish my dear? affraid Laughing

Only for a besom brooooom Laughing

Love
GWE
XXXX


Last edited by GWE on Fri Jul 25, 2008 12:42 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : I misheard EHE's spelling of BESOM!)
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sinderella
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 12:50 am

GWE wrote:
sinderella wrote:
GWE wrote:
I think mine came from a very early age, I have very vivid memories from when I was 18 months old of living next door to a funeral directors and for years I was too small too look over the garden wall. I was desperate to look over the wall to see the coffins. Also my Uncle was a carpenter and in his back garden was always old bits of wood and one day I built a make shift coffin and gave the yard broom a buriel scratch , my Nan really told me off!! Neutral

Love
GWE
XXX


...and do you still have a broom fetish my dear? affraid Laughing

Only for a besom brooooom Laughing

Love
GWE
XXXX


Would that be Bosom perchance? lol!
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 4:55 am

Thats a really good topic! Smile!!!



I dont think a propencity for "Gothiness" is at all genetic. My parents are absolutely the furthest thing from Goth, they werent hippies, they werent punks etc. Neither of my siblings are in any way anything but "normal" people. Jeans and tshirts sorts, though theyre both lovely people.

I think a lot of Goth's come to it from their own internal navigation. Ive always been weird. I honestly had never heard the word Goth until I was about 18, and this was after years of dressing like a cinematic Vampire.....(hand on forehead)....fangs and all...yes tease me...i deserve it....
anyway

I often wonder if someone steering towards a Goth sensibility does so only for their own personal self expression. I dont personally know any Goths who do it to "piss off" their parents or to rebel specifically. I think there are much more societally acceptable ways to annoy your parents than to dive into a dark lifestyle.

Im sure being in an open and artistic home environment would encourage such, but thats not the environment in which I was born and it hasnt affected my turn-out. Lol.



I think those who are "truly" Gothic and arent doing it for the clothes alone or the music alone, would likely dress and act the exact same way if there was never a term coined for the behavior. But maybe I feel that way because Im an old fogey...
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 5:35 am

I think my "gothiness" was just a product of nurturing. My family has always been fairly dark.
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 5:49 am

it seemed to start at quite an early age for me... I'd say 3rdish. I always hated pink, and opted for purples and greens and greys, and black, the darker the better. I loved fantasy things, 'dark' things, etc. I remember one year wanting to be Maleficent for Halloween in 4th grade, and I think 5th I wanted to be a Harpy (Mom thought I was a bit crazy for that one). I think I was born into it partially, but at the same time, I was picked on a lot, and probably associated the super pink, bubbly, barbie type girls with my torment of being 'the wierd art girl'.

Sorry, rambling there... I suppose I'm just not sure. I could argue the nature vs nuture both ways. Perhaps its a combo of the 2. Certain personalties will take to diferent things differently.
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 7:01 am

I always wonder if gothiness or similar means of non-conformity are more apt to be produced as an equal and opposite reaction to a staid, oppressive society. Or whether it thrives more in places where it is fostered and accepted.

"Weirdness" is organic I think. Goth itself is something you choose- the clothes you wear, your music- even if you have inherent personality-based tendencies toward it. I was a weird kid from a young age. I didn't like girl stuff, the rubbish on the radio, organized religion or the things you needed to do to be "cool." It seemed almost like a natural course of action getting into the goth scene. I was about six and I thought Morticia Addams was the most beautiful woman in the world and I wanted to be her. Go figure.
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 7:12 am

Nika wrote:
it seemed to start at quite an early age for me... I'd say 3rdish. I always hated pink, and opted for purples and greens and greys, and black, the darker the better. I loved fantasy things, 'dark' things, etc. I remember one year wanting to be Maleficent for Halloween in 4th grade, and I think 5th I wanted to be a Harpy (Mom thought I was a bit crazy for that one). I think I was born into it partially, but at the same time, I was picked on a lot, and probably associated the super pink, bubbly, barbie type girls with my torment of being 'the wierd art girl'.

Sorry, rambling there... I suppose I'm just not sure. I could argue the nature vs nuture both ways. Perhaps its a combo of the 2. Certain personalties will take to diferent things differently.

Much the same here for me. I remember going through a dark purple phase in 3rd grade...EVERYTHING I wore, right down to my pantaloons, had to be purple. I always hated mainstream music... I studded everything I owned with Bedazzlers... and I spent alot of time alone, colouring, drawing, or writing. I read every single book there was in the children's section of the library by the time I was ten. And lordy did I get crap for being such a hermit. But I really just never felt like I related to any of my surrounding peers... I felt much more connected to the faeries and dragons in my books than the snot-nosed kid next to me. Very Happy It may be partly nurture, as my mother was the first to hand me Interview With A Vampire when I was 11...but for the most part, I honestly do believe we are born with the Gothic "seed", if you will, already in our hearts... we can't help what we are drawn to. Some are drawn like moths to a flame...others are drawn to blacklights. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 1:24 pm

gloomth wrote:
I dont think a propencity for "Gothiness" is at all genetic.
It is possible to possess qualities from birth that were not inherited from your parents. Physical abnormalities are an unfortunate example, an 'ear for music' is a pleasanter case.

I'd also suggest that very few homosexuals came from gay parents!

You mention your own "internal navigation", which to me suggests a quality that you feel is intrinsic to you and not something you have acquired from your environment.

Were you born containing the seds of your own gothism?

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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 6:36 pm

As an evolutionary adaptation, animals are biologically wired to have different human-like personalities, so perhaps as our own adaptation, certain people are born to have goth-like characteristics.
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 10:40 pm

That's a whole thread in itself: What evolutionary advantages does goth bring to the human race. What survival skills do goths have to give them an edge over their competitors in the survival of the fittest!

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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Fri Jul 25, 2008 11:33 pm

EvilHippyEmperor wrote:
That's a whole thread in itself: What evolutionary advantages does goth bring to the human race. What survival skills do goths have to give them an edge over their competitors in the survival of the fittest!

I don't know, but with the footwear I see on some people, not much. Night camouflage maybe. Darwin favors rivetheads Twisted Evil
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Sat Jul 26, 2008 2:45 am

That's what got me thinking, what advantages do goths bring to the species. I would have to do research to find out.
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Sat Jul 26, 2008 11:33 am

I was the strang little kid. I was mix of a jazz/blues loving, tomboyish, book worm. My reading choice introduced me to the darker side of things and i was hooked.
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Sat Jul 26, 2008 11:34 pm

Morella wrote:
EvilHippyEmperor wrote:
That's a whole thread in itself: What evolutionary advantages does goth bring to the human race. What survival skills do goths have to give them an edge over their competitors in the survival of the fittest!

I don't know, but with the footwear I see on some people, not much. Night camouflage maybe. Darwin favors rivetheads Twisted Evil

HAhaha I thought the same thing!!
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PostSubject: Re: Nature or Nurture?   Mon Aug 11, 2008 12:22 am

Ginger_Snaps wrote:
That's what got me thinking, what advantages do goths bring to the species. I would have to do research to find out.
Well, we do keep the rest of the world from plummeting into a downward spiral of conformity and boring ugly clothing. We are to the rest of the world; what Edward Scissorhands, The Addams Family, and The Munsters were to their own respective towns.


I don't think that people are born goths, but I do think that people are born with certain personality traits that allow them to be goths. Like the people who are kind of shunned by 'all the other kids' at a young age, probably have the personality type that makes the other kids be a bit wary of them. They might not necessarily be goths, but they'll definently be "different."

I was one of the weird kids from an early age. I spent a lot of time by myself, and didn't really have many friends. The kind of herd mentality fostered by religion and sports was never really pushed on me. Though I wasn't really a goth from a young age, I was just a little bit strange to most people.
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